In this episode of ESSENCE Now’s “Kitchen Table Talk,” we gathered a panel of Black and White writers and activists to discuss the differences in how Black and White people view racism.

For ESSENCE’s Christina Coleman and co-host of the The Extraordinary Negroes, Alexander Hardy, conversations about race with white people are extremely fraught.

“In the time of Charlottesville and Donald Trump, I’m finding that it’s really not my job to teach White people what they should know about racism,” said Coleman. “It’s a very, malicious and obvious and blatant disregard for other people in this country, and they don’t want to accept that.”

Jezebel writer Rich Juzwiak thinks there should be some distinction between “overt” and “passive” racism. He explained, “There’s active white supremacy, like Klansmen, and then there’s passive white supremacy that goes un-commented on a lot of the time.”

Activist Daveen Trentman also discussed the criticism she faced wearing a ‘Black Lives Matter’ t-shirt as a White woman. “Wearing a shirt that says Black Lives Matter is just making a very simple point that Black lives matter, and White people need to be at the forefront putting our bodies on the line. That is where we do the work,” Trentman explained. 

Check out the conversation above.